Marines Why Marines like Garp support the World Government.

Discussion in 'Characters, Groups & Organizations Discussion' started by ThisGuy222, Sep 8, 2018.

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  1. ThisGuy222

    ThisGuy222

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    One of the biggest questions myself and friends ask is why someone like Garp, and other honorable Marines, would ever support such a corrupt institition like the World Government. The WG literally exists with the sole purpose of expanding and maintaining the power of a small elite, the Celestial Dragons, who are given the freedom to do anything they please. The laws of WG do not apply to them, and the free to kill, rape, kidnap, and enslave anyone they desire.

    So many fans of the series would naturally ask how can Garp or Smoker or anyone else justify their service to WG. Every day they uphold and defend an inherently unjust system the has ruined many lives, despite claiming to be the embodiment of justice.

    But there are two things people should keep in mind, reasons that I think explain how they vould justify their service.

    1. Imagine a world with no World Government and no Navy. Look at Whitebeard's home or Wano. That's what happens to countries with no real protection and no allies. Should the WG collapse, EVERY country could potentially end up like Wano. Furthermore, there is no indication that an alternative is better. There is no indication that the Revolutionaries are any fairer or more just.

    2. There are far more pirates in the world than Celestial Dragons. Its easy to forget that most pirates are not like Luffy. Pirates like Kaido and Blackbeard have committed atrocities that are just as bad if not worse than the Nobles, and on a much larger scale. While the Marines might despise them, there are only probably a few hundred Celestial Dragons, as opposed to hundreds of thousand or millions of pirates (and counting). Its clear that the rulers and citizens of the individual nations agree with this, as they choose to pay tribute to the Dragons rather than be at the mercy of pirates (and the incidents in Alabasta and Dressrosa show they still arent safe).

    It's easy for us to forget that the threats that citizens face in the world of One Piece are much different than what we as readers experience in our world. The world of One Piece is chaotic and violent. If your hometown was frequently raided by pirates, you may just willing to tolerate the rule of cruel and evil individuals in exchange for protection. I love the portrayal of the Navy. Its not an evil organization, but an organization run by flawed men and women who are just trying to protect whats dear to them. I think we as fans should try more often to be empathetic towards them when we discuss their relationship with those they serve.
     
  2. Beky

    Beky Roger Cracker Katakuri

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    Why did Wehrmacht follow SS in WW2?

    Soldier is a soldier - Marine is a Marine

    You follow orders no mather from which source they come from. That's a life of a soldier
     
  3. Herr Krokodil

    Herr Krokodil

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    More or less what I feel. Soldiers are soldiers, and follow orders.
     
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  4. silverfire

    silverfire

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    Quality post. I ask myself this a lot, too. You’re completely spot on, I think that most marines are good, and most pirates are bad. But, the people at the very top crave to seek power and consolidate it. The celestial dragons are corrupt, but many if not most under them aren't.

    I'm still entertaining the possibility that even the Gorosei are gray characters, and perhaps even that the ancient civilization wasn't all good. But even at face value, they keep the world stable despite also committing atrocities.

    Most of the important marines we've been introduced to do not fit this bill.

    Smoker has constantly been at odds with his superiors.

    Garp refused to be promoted past VA so that he could do as he pleased.

    Kuzan was frustrated with the position he was put into in Ohara, and still wants to make a difference in the world after leaving the marines.

    Fujitora went against orders to attempt to expose corruption and bring the Shichibukai to justice.

    Even Akainu, who’s epithet represents his loyalty, was extremely frustrated with the Gorosei for covering for “scum” like Doflamingo. Despite his brutality, he simply seeks his version of justice and hates corruption.

    Most of the pirates we’ve come across are just in it for themselves. Many of the marines are genuinely trying to make a positive difference, despite the red tape and corruption they have to deal with.
     
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  5. Xlaw

    Xlaw Roger

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    There is no black and white ! There r many corrupts among WG but have some good one too. The world need someone to protect. You can't challenge the entire WG, all you can you do is try to change the system from within.
    Admirals Justice (Lazy Justice , Absolute Justice etc) indicate that.
    Look at smoker and Fujitora , they have their own sense of justice. They follow WG's orders but if it's necessary they bend it too..
    And about Garp , he was known for acting his own. He was hero of the Marin yet he protected the bloodline of WG's biggest enemy. So he too has his own sense of justice.
     
    Last edited: Sep 9, 2018
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  6. Guan_Yu

    Guan_Yu

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    In my honest opinion, Garp is not a pro Marines, but rather against a Criminal.
     
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  7. Just a member

    Just a member

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    WG is not black or white, it is grey. It has its pro and cons. It can be related to old (or even modern, it doesn't change much in the end) medieval kingdoms. Was it better to serve under your feudal lord inside the walls of his castle or be free outside of them at least until a band of brigands, pirates (depends on location) or whatever, even your own former lord, come to reclame your possessions violently?
     
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  8. Travolta

    Travolta

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    garp only does what he wants.
    he saves the kid of the pirate king because he thinks its the right thing to do.

    garp is only in the marines to protect people.
     
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  9. rayanOO

    rayanOO

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    I totally agree that Marine soldiers like Garp are neither good or bad, they follow the World government to make a difference even a small one.

    It is what makes Dragon an exceptional individual. He doesn't tolerate discriminations anymore, the racism, the protection of the Celestial Dragons, the genocides etc. And he left everything : his father, certainly a good carreer in the Marine etc to make the world a better place.

    Even if there is only the WG, if your boss ask you to wipe out a whole island and killed everyone for no reasons you have to leave this organisation and don't follow orders anymore.

    I understand that countries want protection from the WG, without it they would be attacked every day. But Prime Garp was a total monster and could have become a Yonko anyday if he has left the Marine . He could have gather a strong crew, protected islands and made the world a better place there. If you make a Totto land like Big mom you could protected thousands or millions people.
    He chose to stay in the Marine and it doesn't make him a bad person, to leave everything is extremely hard and there are a lot of risks and Garp protected a lot of people in the Marine but it is not a good choice either, because to stay means being responsible for what the WG has done.

    And about the RA I don't agree with your judgment. We know that revolution can be bloody and be worst that what they fight against. But Garp could have left to start an other organisation, his own organisation. If you are under a power that bad a revolution even an uncertain one can be better than the statu quo.

    Dragon created a full scale organisation to take over the WG and he proved to everybody that there is an other choice than the WG and that it is possible.
     
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2018
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  10. Kuroshika

    Kuroshika

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    I hope FA Sakazuki will throw the corrupts in a volcano tbh
    I think he took fujitora in order to get rid of the shishibuckai.
    Ryokugyu is a strong ally and Kizaru follow his old pal so the end of the corrupted mofos is probably near
     
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  11. Herr Krokodil

    Herr Krokodil

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    Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't Dragon's goal not to topple the WG but rather the CDs
     
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  12. Veljko

    Veljko

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    They still fight Pirates.... And they try to keep peace in world
     
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  13. rayanOO

    rayanOO

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    The CD are the families who established the WG. And the Five elders are the Head of the WG and the highest ranking CD. So if Dragon wants to topple the CD he wants to topple the WG. Dragon can maybe overthrown the CD without destroying all the WG but a WG without the CD is not at all the same WG.

    The CD control everything : Marine, politics, secrets etc.
     
  14. TheoryKing

    TheoryKing

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    1 issue: A soldier chooses to be a soldier, and does have the choice to obey or disobey. As Garp himself displayed throughout his life.
    --- Double Post Merged, Sep 12, 2018, Original Post Date: Sep 12, 2018 ---
    They don't follow the World Government, they follow the marines. When a person joins the US army or any army in their respective country, a lot of them aren't doing it to "follow" their governments, but for the purpose of the army itself and what their army does.
    --- Double Post Merged, Sep 12, 2018 ---
    How can a corrupt extremist throw away corrupt people? lol
     
  15. Kuroshika

    Kuroshika

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    Where tf is Sakazuki corrupted
     
  16. Herr Krokodil

    Herr Krokodil

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    But's let be frank, if the CD's all just dispersed one day, most of the WG would still function as is. The WG doesn't need the CD's to run it. They leave the running to other's. And as I said, I think it was out right stated that there goal wasn't the WG but the CD's.
     
  17. rayanOO

    rayanOO

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    There is a link between the army and the government. It is the government which decides where and what the army does. If you are a Marine in a corrupt gouvernment you will do bad things.
     
  18. TheoryKing

    TheoryKing

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    -> Kills marines for simply abandoning a warzone = murderer
    -> Has the backing of the World Government higher ups himself, that you're calling corrupt = not corrupt?
    -> Is an extremist, with the mentality of "all pirates are criminals"
    -> Slaughtered civilians leaving Ohara, that were allowed to leave by the WG itself
    -> Was about to slaughter a young 17 year old soldier in front of the world, for simply getting in his way.

    If we had Sakazuki in real life, you're looking at a dictator.. or a military General that would be put on a tribunal.
    --- Double Post Merged, Sep 12, 2018, Original Post Date: Sep 12, 2018 ---
    Not necessarily. Majority of the army soldiers haven't done "bad things". While many of the governments of the world are "corrupt". Because more often than not, the army's job is merely to protect civilians that they rule over. If the army turns against the people it's protecting then you have a point. Marines are the "protectors" of the world of one piece, hence many young people wanting to change good things join them (like Smoker/Kuzan and etc).


    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2018
  19. rayanOO

    rayanOO

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    Obviously Dragon doesn't need to destroy every country or every Marine soldiers to sucess, but if he kills all the CD he kills the leader of the WG. The WG is run by the Five Elders : they have authority over everything the WG does. If the CD don't exist anymore the WG will be drastically different.

    Dragon goal is the CD because they are the reason why the world is like that. If you take out the CD you can make a new order.
    --- Double Post Merged, Sep 12, 2018, Original Post Date: Sep 12, 2018 ---
    If you are a soldiers even a good one in a gouvernment which does atrocious things and you stay your are responsible as if you have done the things yourself. The WG orders the Marine to wipe out islands, allowed slavery etc.

    The army is the weapon of the government, the army doesn't make decisions, army follows orders.
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2018
  20. Herr Krokodil

    Herr Krokodil

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    Proably not. You'd lose the corrupt leaders, but how it's actually run on a day to day bases wouldn't change much. The CD asside from the Five Elders are do nothing figure heads and even the Elders are only seen acting when the power Balance is threatened. On an administrative level all the branches of government wouldn't be much affected.

    What would change is the CD ability to tax the life out of nations and the ability to take slaves. That is a better world, but most of the branchs of government wouldn't be affected. And Dragon shouldn't really want that gone. If the WG just dropped out of the picture, it would casue far more problems.
     
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