Fights & Battles Kaido: A New Type Of Challenge. The 1st Time Luffy Defeats Someone Physically Stronger

Discussion in 'One Piece Manga Discussion' started by SanjiKun, Aug 11, 2018.

Tags:

Share This Page

  1. SanjiKun

    SanjiKun

    Messages:
    17,303
    Likes Received:
    31,965
    Trophy Points:
    29,910
    Bounty Points:
    0
    When Oda mentioned Luffy will defeat Kaido, he made one thing clear: It will not be because "Luffy's punch is so strong". He even mentioned when Kaido first appeared, Luffy was not strong enough yet to defeat him. What exactly is Oda entailing by this? Well, we don't have to look far. The last opponent Luffy defeated at that time (Doflamingo), was defeated exactly because Luffy's punch "was so strong".

    [​IMG]

    In fact, every opponent Luffy has defeated so far he has been physically stronger than. Why is this significant? Well we know for a fact Luffy is not overall a better combatant than every opponent he's faced. With Crocodile this was obvious in Marineford, and with Enel Oda outright stated it. He said was lucky he was rubber. But nonetheless he was still stronger than both Crocodile/Enel physically. I recently made a thread outlining why Katakuri was a good milestone for Luffy. They are very similar in fighting style, and Luffy actually could use him as a measuring stick. With guys like Crocodile, Enel, Doflamingo, Moriah, Cracker, it's very hard for Luffy to measure his overall ability, simply because they fight very differently. What makes them good is not what makes Luffy good.

    https://orojackson.com/threads/katakuris-role-as-a-milestone-for-luffy.54835/#post-3500787

    Just like, even if Zoro defeats Pica, Zoro still wants to develop as a swordsman, rather than just be a strong guy, Luffy even if he defeats all those dudes with dissimilar styles, still wants to develop primarily as a brawler more than anything.

    How Luffy defeats opponents is he negates/circumvents their DF ability (or DF combined with CoO in Enel's/Katakuri's cases) and/or he overpowers them physically. This seems kinda simple at first, but it's a very important point in the "Is Luffy stronger than the guys he beats?" debate. Whether he is a better overall combatant that those guys is up for debate, but what isn't, is that he is simply physically stronger.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Kaido represents a new type of challenge. While before Luffy simply had to figure out some way around their DF/DF + CoO combo, and overpower them physically, Kaido is not that type of opponent. Even if you figure out some way around his possible DF (Zooan?), you cannot overpower Kaido physically.

    Luffy has defeated better overall fighters than him before (and I'd argue the gap between Croc/Enel and Luffy is much bigger than Luffy/Kaido now), but he has never defeated someone physically stronger than him.
     
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2018
  2. SMILE

    SMILE

    Messages:
    23,462
    Likes Received:
    317,881
    Trophy Points:
    33,030
    Bounty Points:
    4,950
    For sure it should present a new challenge for him and a whole different one. It's an Emperor of the sea and the strongest living creature.
     
    KOPLO and Sanji_ like this.
  3. Sanji_

    Sanji_ The Gambit Wanted Katakuri Smoothie

    Messages:
    2,347
    Likes Received:
    16,395
    Trophy Points:
    13,780
    Bounty Points:
    5,850
    Excellent review and i couldn't agree more in Luffy never defeated someone physically stronger than him before.

    But he had tactics and analysis during the battle which ade him draw the upper hand..
     
  4. operatico

    operatico

    Messages:
    362
    Likes Received:
    549
    Trophy Points:
    5,460
    Bounty Points:
    0
    Lucci was physically stronger at the start of the fight but Luffy had better endurance and overcame his own limits.
    So were the admirals and magellan that Luffy fought and lost against.
     
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2018
  5. Zeroishero

    Zeroishero

    Messages:
    801
    Likes Received:
    641
    Trophy Points:
    4,710
    Bounty Points:
    0
    The gap between Enel and Luffy wasnt big at all. It was very small. The gap between Kaidou and Kuffy is very very big compared to that.
     
  6. RobinGloriousBoobs

    RobinGloriousBoobs

    Messages:
    1,382
    Likes Received:
    2,773
    Trophy Points:
    8,960
    Bounty Points:
    0
    Lucci was physically stronger than him.
    It's just Luffy had bigger power spike from his DF than Lucci.
     
    Travolta and Kyro Kakugi like this.
  7. ardym

    ardym

    Messages:
    8,363
    Likes Received:
    28,877
    Trophy Points:
    26,840
    Bounty Points:
    4,000
    Well physically Kaido is for sure the strongest
     
  8. D Sanji

    D Sanji

    Messages:
    16,818
    Likes Received:
    58,298
    Trophy Points:
    32,030
    Bounty Points:
    0
    Yeah Luffy isn't beating Kaido solo. And if he does, it kills the future hype for his fights with Akainu and BB, cause Kaido is the strongest in a 1 v 1
     
  9. ardym

    ardym

    Messages:
    8,363
    Likes Received:
    28,877
    Trophy Points:
    26,840
    Bounty Points:
    4,000
    and Luffy is known for being able to make the impossible possible so we cannot discard the possibility.
     
    goli92 and KOPLO like this.
  10. mettalica.D.symon

    mettalica.D.symon

    Messages:
    13,001
    Likes Received:
    43,221
    Trophy Points:
    32,000
    Bounty Points:
    1,700
    We are now in the big leagues. I think Katakuri also falls in this category, Luffy was physically weaker than him even with geat 4th. All the yonko are kind of guaranteed to be physically stronger than him. It will be interesting to see how Oda writes this fights.
     
    luffyq1 likes this.
  11. ardym

    ardym

    Messages:
    8,363
    Likes Received:
    28,877
    Trophy Points:
    26,840
    Bounty Points:
    4,000
    and to be honest i cannot agree that Luffy was physically stronger , u can say he is more durable but he is physically weaker than the most of his enemies
     
    Travolta likes this.
  12. D Sanji

    D Sanji

    Messages:
    16,818
    Likes Received:
    58,298
    Trophy Points:
    32,030
    Bounty Points:
    0
    With the amount of people who have beef with Kaido, no ones gonna let Luffy defeat him by himself. This is not a Cracker or Katakuri situation,
     
    Sanji W. Smoke, Yaksha and Tartan Owl like this.
  13. SMILE

    SMILE

    Messages:
    23,462
    Likes Received:
    317,881
    Trophy Points:
    33,030
    Bounty Points:
    4,950
    Well there will be others who will try their fangs on him. Kidd would want that, maybe some samurais in between, then we have Franky who mentioned he wants to build some weapons against Kaido.

    Then we have Law where Kaido tore appart his wanted poster too so he will be forced to fight him head on either way whether he wants or not.
     
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2018
    Topi Jerami and Yaksha like this.
  14. ardym

    ardym

    Messages:
    8,363
    Likes Received:
    28,877
    Trophy Points:
    26,840
    Bounty Points:
    4,000
    they will have to face so many opponents and they will not be enough if u ask me
    --- Double Post Merged, Aug 11, 2018, Original Post Date: Aug 11, 2018 ---
    the most realistic one will be Law but really , i don't discard that possibilty either but , Luffy is just known for that and his major fight where he declares that he defeat somebody from the beginning he does it alone .
     
  15. SMILE

    SMILE

    Messages:
    23,462
    Likes Received:
    317,881
    Trophy Points:
    33,030
    Bounty Points:
    4,950
    It is different the set up due to what was said...
    --- Double Post Merged, Aug 11, 2018, Original Post Date: Aug 11, 2018 ---
    He will defeat Kaido in the end no doubt but there will be some interferences in between if you wana call that.

    Kidd, Law, a tiny chance some samurais, then Franky and his weapons which the sole purpose he wants to build them are for Kaido.
     
  16. ardym

    ardym

    Messages:
    8,363
    Likes Received:
    28,877
    Trophy Points:
    26,840
    Bounty Points:
    4,000
    why then Oda says that he doesn't know how will Luffy defeat Kaido , he could have said that Luffy and his allies , and that he and Luffy will find solution to be honest , i tend to the possibility that Oda gonna give Luffy power ups and some tricks to defeat him alone
     
  17. SMILE

    SMILE

    Messages:
    23,462
    Likes Received:
    317,881
    Trophy Points:
    33,030
    Bounty Points:
    4,950
    Read above what I said about it. Luffy will defeat him in the end.
     
  18. ardym

    ardym

    Messages:
    8,363
    Likes Received:
    28,877
    Trophy Points:
    26,840
    Bounty Points:
    4,000
    well maybe they try to land some attacks on him but i think no one of them will be able to scrach him with exception of Luffy.
    i don't like that they fight him all and Luffy gives him the last blow when he already is weekend because of the others , in other words i don't think it is gonna be like against Doflamingo
     
  19. Jo_Ndule

    Jo_Ndule

    Messages:
    9,567
    Likes Received:
    19,012
    Trophy Points:
    26,770
    Bounty Points:
    200
    Solo?
    Rip one piece in advance
    --- Double Post Merged, Aug 11, 2018, Original Post Date: Aug 11, 2018 ---
    This is not katakuri nor lucci
    This is Kaido the best in 1 vs 1
    THERE is kidd who just got beaten and will want revenge
    THERE is also law

    It'll be every supernova vs Kaido
    then
    3 vs 1
    Then luffy lands the final blows
     
  20. SanjiKun

    SanjiKun

    Messages:
    17,303
    Likes Received:
    31,965
    Trophy Points:
    29,910
    Bounty Points:
    0
    To all those saying Lucci and Katakuri were physically stronger. That is factually incorrect. Katakuri I don't even have to explain, given the fact that Luffy never even used King Kong Gun.

    As for Lucci, not only did Luffy have to overcome his strength, he had to overcome his Tekkai. Tekkai is not strength, but it is hardness, just like CoA. For Luffy to overcome someone's strength and Tekkai at the same time, proves he was at a higher level physically (though I wouldn't say by much). This reminds me of Amazon Lily, where they were surprised Luffy one shot the Panther without even using Haki, just raw strength.

    Lucci for example cannot match this type of attack in terms of raw power:

    [​IMG]
    Whatever happens in that battle, Luffy will be the primary taker down of Kaido. Oda made this very clear. That's why he said "me and Luffy will have to find a solution".
    That is very wrong. Oda himself stated otherwise. Luffy can already push Kaido to a mid diff, given he's on par with their right hands. Luffy on Skypeia, was what, Commodore level? X Drake was Rear Admiral, and Luffy only seemed on par with him after G2/G3. Enel on the other hand is like high Vice Admiral level.

    Someone on a higher end Vice Admiral level fighting a guy on Commodore level is unheard of. That's usually a no diff.
     
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2018
    marcjean820 and KOPLO like this.
  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice